[Info] NIB Horses
By Retired breeder, 17th November 2009 23:20:05
It's about time the NIB breeders had their own corner of the world  Curious about NIB horses? Want to know what a NIB horse is? You've come to the right place! What is this topic for? NIB enthusiasts to find each other and help one another progress in their respective games. Otherwise, you may use this topic to help others learn about NIBs, share your experience, and find friends that breed NIBs  Please do not use this topic for advertising horses for sale. The NIB FAQ: What is a NIB horse? A NIB horse is a horse that is not inbred; every horse in its pedigree appears only once (with the exception of Ouranos and Gaia). Horses with "Horse Disappeared" in their pedigree are generally not accepted by NIB breeders unless the horses in question were bought before the horses disappeared and have verifiable pedigrees. Are there green star NIB horses? These horses have lower GP than green stars and other top horses, as not inbreeding limits the breeding availability and is slower to progress than breeding brothers to sisters and so forth. **Misabel edit: The first Green star NIB horse was created on February 21, 2011 - a 6th generation Connemara pony with a star in stamina. He was the end result of a lot of hard work and effort, but now that some dedicated breeders have shown it can be done, we all have something to shoot for! Are NIB horses considered better than green stars or inbred horses? Goodness, no! Nobody here is attempting to make that claim. Just like the Zero GP horses, these players choose to play the game in their own challenging way. How can I get involved with NIB breeding? It's simple! Start by purchasing a few foundation horses, or horses whose pedigrees can be tracked down and verified as non-inbred. Then carefully breed them to create foals with good GP's and skills that are not inbred! - Current Top GPs for NIB Horses: (bred with the *original foundies* who had 350-351.2 GP) Akhal-Teke: 433.29 (2*) Appaloosa: 592.04 (10*) 6th Gen Arabians : 847.17 (31*) 3rd Gen Argentinean Criollo: 534.37 (7*) 1st Gen Barbs: 392.93 (1*) Brumbies: 441.30 (2*) Canadian: 710.75 (18*) 2nd gen Curly : 897.50 (33*) 3rd Gen Donkeys: 300.42 Friesian : 507.78 (6*) 2nd Gen Gypsy Vanner: 565.03 (9*) Hackneys: 608.80 (11*) 2nd Gen Hanoverians: 618.73 (12*) Holsteiner: 584.14 (11*) 1st gen Icelandic Horse: 431.19 (1*) Irish Hunters: 452.22 (2*) Knabstrupper: 564.89 (8*) 1st gen KWPN: 414.32 (1*) Lipizzans: 451.15 (2*) Lusitanos: 558.72 (10*) Marwari: 551.66 (8*) 1st gen Morgans: 411.95 (1*) Mustangs: 419.50 (1*) Nokota : 427.57 (2*) Paints: 461.44 (2*) Peruvian Paso: 441.91 (2*) Purebred Spanish Horse : 509.03 (6*) 1st gen Quarter Horse: 450.30 (2*) Russian Don: 636.94 (13*) Shagya Arabian : 767.55 (25*) 5th gen Standardbreds: 469.76 (3*) Tennessee Walkers: 378.92 (1*) Thoroughbred: 1086.54 (52*) 7th Gen Trakhener: 432.77 (1*) Australian Pony: 581.44 (9*) 1st gen Chincoteague Pony : 575.97 (8*) 1st gen Connemaras: 440.00 (2*) Fjords: 447.42 (1*) Haflingers: 496.41 (4*) Highland Pony: 409.22 Newfoundlands: 417.87 (1*) Quarter Pony: 477.27 (4*) Shetland : 591.53 (11*) 1st gen Welsh: 415.59 (1*) Percherons: 503.74 (3*) Shires: 461.15 (2*) Drum horse: 1911.21 (134*) - Current Top GPs for NIB Horses: (bred with the *'new' foundies* who have the higher GP) Barb : 5010.37 (445*) 2nd gen Camargue : 4944.16 (438*) 2nd Gen Canadians: 4019.57 (346*) 3rd gen Curlys: 4480.67 (391*) Hanoverian: 5510.41 (494*) 1st Gen Holsteiner: 4627.18 (405*) 1st Gen Knabstruppers: 3611.72 Finnish : 7001.13 (*642*) 1st gen French Trotter: 5674.95 (511*) 2nd gen Friesian: 4608.48 (404*) 2nd Gen Lustiano : 4977.80 (441*) 1st gen Mangalarga Marchador: 7417.82 (685*) 4th gen Marwari : 5409.48 (484*) 1st Gen Nokotas: 5283.03 (471*) 3rd Gen Paint Horse: 3094.08 (252*) Purebred Spanish Horse : 6045.91 5th gen Quarter Horse: 3104.63 (253*) Russian Don: 6747.60 (617*) 1st Gen Kerry Bog: 3892.85 (332*) Newfoundland Pony: 6955.84 (639*) 1gen Welsh: 6844.92 (627*) 2nd Gen Ban'ei: 7638.35 (707*) 3rd gen Drum Horse : 2378.86 (181*) 5th Gen Percheron: 5508.49 (494*) 1st Gen Shire : 5067.74 (451*) 2nd Gen Rivenwood's update schedule: Sundays: Players breeding non-inbred horses may post the GPs of the horses they think are amongst the highest in the breed in this topic. Complete details should include everything listed in the form below. **Please DO NOT Submit GPs for rankings EXCEPT on Sunday!** Misabel will post the latest high GP's for NIB horses in each breed from the Sunday submissions. Horses will not be named Please submit your entry to the current high NIB GP using the following format in a post. It is important you use this exact format so Misabel can locate your post easily, or your submission may be missed: My NIB GP Entry Horse's Name: Horse's Breed (purebreds only please): Current GP: Link to the Horse's Page: |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 02:22:47
You know what is truly ironic.. when you enter a comp and it seems like you are competeing constantly against your own bloodlines lmao.
I go to enter a comp and poof! The horse I sold ends up kicking my rear lmao. Makes me wonder if I sold the wrong horse lol |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 04:28:31
(Friesians)
I've got my hands on a second colt and mare to blup. I'm thinking I'll just work with them for now until they are blupped since I also have the 0gp project and my others to work with. If anyone is interested in being my NIB friesian partner, drop me some lines. The beginning of next year I'll be able to get more passes on a regular basis then right now. Holidays got my pockets tight.  |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 06:28:46
(marwaris)
i have started breeding NIB marwaris to, me being my lucky ducky self i found a foundation Marwari colt in the private sales, and i got him to 351.20 GP after games! But me being my unlucky self at 1 yr 4 month's i some how went over 22:00 hours so he had low energy witch means tomorrow he will be grumpy!  but im still very proud of him  . If anyone has a young foundation mare that you would be willing to sale/let me barrow please let me know  . |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 09:25:04
Since some players were asking about BLUPing methods... Here's the one I use with my foundies/NIBs (and all my horses actually - it just works well with the NIBs too).
wordweasel2's Guide to BLUPing. It's always worked well for me - possible because wordweasel2 was a fantastic NIB breeder (sadly she quit a long time ago now) and probably formulated it with 350-ish GP horses in mind. I do find that with this schedule wins are quie easy to pick up as you begin entering each comp with a low level of training in the entry skill. |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 19:24:28
It was mentioned further back abouta forum for selling NIB horses. Well .. on that Note . My Ec forum is open to use for this Purpose. I have a topic up for the selling of NIB connies as well as a seperate one for foundation connies.
All breeders are welcome to use the forum regardless of the breed.. to sell there NIB horses.. or to even create a topic to find a specific type of NIB horse. I hope that people will use it as it will be a another means of knowing the individuals who are breeding similar NIB horses. |
livelyblueyes - great idea with the forum. I try to keep an updated list of Foundation Hanos in the auctions in my forum. If I had more knowledge of data mining coding I'd create an off howrse site that would simply have its own auction and private sale pages of only NIB horses... but alas I have more code learning to do. Perhaps if we asked Rivenwood nicely to ask the creator of the family tree page to look into this...
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By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 20:08:06
livelyblueyes, I cannot access your EC forum.
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By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 20:26:00
heh no worries you should be able to access it now
I had to readjust the setting lol . I had a total blonde moment |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 20:34:03
Great idea livelyblueyes. I will be posting my sales there
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By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 20:42:47
This is off topic, but there are pass seeds in stock right now, but they are going seriously fast
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By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 20:50:12
lol, thanks livelyblueyes.
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By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 23:25:12
Rivenwood i have a question. Back on page 3 you said its best to start off with 10 foundies, 4 mares and 6 stallions (or the other way round lol ). I was just wondering why the number of stallions to mares is not even....im new to NIB but it seems like you would need a even number so you could get 5 foals and then not have to breed the stallions again.....i hope i made sense
. Sidney102. |
By Retired breeder, 27th November 2009 23:51:42
I have been wondering the same thing, sidney102.
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By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 02:37:53
My NIB GP Entry
Horse's Name: Theia-NIB♀ ¢яμĩ§ĩή70ťÿ of ĦßäяŁ Horse's Breed (purebreds only please): Friesian Current GP (foals without completed games do not count): 352.75 Link to the Horse's Page: Theia-NIB♀ |
By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 02:41:27
Oops, I'll re post on Sunday. I wasn't paying attention. It's been a long day (black Friday shopping). Ugh...
I think my brain stopped working.  |
By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 02:56:53
For the sake of not messing up my lines I made up a little diagram to ask a question. As long as the sire or dam doesn't show up in the breeding line more than once that's considered NIB, correct? I drew this to explain what I'm asking. The mares are in pink.
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj231/thealmightyval/breedingprogram.jpg I'd like to know if my breeding diagram is a good idea and would work. Having just two breeding pairs at a time, one for a colt, one for a filly. Blup those foals then breed the "colt" back to the fillies dam. And breed the "filly" back to the colts sire. I had to draw it out. So I did. Please tell me it would work. Thanks. |
By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 02:58:33
Also, as long as I never breed the "products" of those two lines together I should be good right??
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By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 03:01:14
If I'm wrong, can someone please draw me out a breeding program that works?
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By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 03:08:14
Almighty: The diagram you showed would not be NIB. I am not 100% sure but, as far as i know you cannot have the same horse apper twice in the family tree or its inbreeding. It does not matter how or witch horses. Sorry,
sidney102. |
The best way to ensure that your horse is NIB that I have found, is to go through the family tree, opening the father in a new tab and the mother in the current window until you reach a foundation, and repeat until you have tabs of all foundations. If all the foundations are different, the horse is NIB. If you have a repeat of any foundation horse, then the horse is inbred.
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By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 04:14:18
I just realized my flaw in the diagram. Lol. Wow I feel dumb.
Anyway, I will just have to double check everything before I breed. |
By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 04:19:14
Yeah, you can't use that tree. Sue and Bill would have the same father(Bob) which would destroy the right tree immediately then when you used May in the left tree, it also would be not NIB.
You need to start with more horses as Riven suggested. For example(using part of your tree), If you have Bob + Mary and Jack + Jill you will have two second generation babies, Bill and Jane. Bill and Jane could then have a foal and it would be your third generation. To get to the fourth generation you'd need a whole new tree of Bob2 + Mary2 and Jack2 + Jill2, etc. I hope that helps! |
By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 04:26:33
Can anyone answer my question? I would like to know so i can be sure and start off on the right track.
Sidney102. |
By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 04:33:33
If you're refering to why the 6 mares / 4 stallions question, my assumption is that you'd be leaving those two mares for breeding with outside stallions if you find a partner. For those two lines you're essentially halving the work as long as you find a partner you trust not to leave you with wholes in your tree.
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By Retired breeder, 28th November 2009 04:50:28
Actually.. the reasoning behind that is you can get a greater variety of foals that can still be bred to each other. For instance
My horses Summer Rose 1g and Yellow Rose 1g have the same dam .. but their sires are different. Hence where Summer Rose could be bred to the Stallion Steller who has the same sire as Yellow Rose.. Yellow rose could not be bred to that stud because then the foal would be inbred. However the sires are different. Those two horses could not be bred yet.. you could still breed as I said Summer Rose to Steller and end up with a non-inbred foal. That is more of a reversal of the male/female ratio but it still has the same concept. I am hoping i did not make it overly confusing. Sidney as folks said the diagram you made will not work. The method I have come to use for being able to tell what horse had what parents is by including some reference to both parents in the foals name. This works great for being able to cross your first generation horses and move on into the 3rd generation. After the third generation my preference is to have a totally new breeding farm with affix so as to differentiate those horses entirely from my original line of NIB horses. This leads it to where once I have both breeding farms to 3rd generation horses I will be able to cross them with no worries of inbreeding in that 4th generation. My example of this is quite simple. I have my Low~Ridge affix I am currently working horses up in so they can be bred back to my horsecreek NIB affixed horses. Any horse that I ever used for the horsecreek NIB affix whether foundation or otherwise.. will not be used in the production of my Low~Ridge affix.- horses. Actually , you know I think I confused myself lmao |